Parker Gun Collectors Association Forums  

Go Back   Parker Gun Collectors Association Forums Non-Parker Specific & General Discussions Shotgun Shell Reloading

Notices

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
Unread 04-08-2022, 08:12 PM   #21
Member
Gary Laudermilch
PGCA Member

Member Info
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,326
Thanks: 3,036
Thanked 2,099 Times in 673 Posts

Default

Hmm, hard to believe those huge pressure increases. I have always used Win 209 but now have a supply of Cheddites. I guess there is only one way to know for sure.
Gary Laudermilch is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Gary Laudermilch For Your Post:
Unread 04-08-2022, 08:29 PM   #22
Member
Jim Thoma
PGCA Member

Member Info
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 285
Thanks: 13
Thanked 145 Times in 51 Posts

Default

I reloaded with W209 and cheddite primers with same recipes and did not notice any difference in recoil loaded 20 gauge Winchester AA with unique powder, shot one box with the W209 and a box of cheddites and seen no difference.
Jim Thoma is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-08-2022, 08:51 PM   #23
Member
Milton C Starr
Forum Associate

Member Info
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 1,500
Thanks: 475
Thanked 1,000 Times in 462 Posts

Default

I was just reading a thread on another forum where someone managed to get 14k psi with their normal load because they had over compressed the load, perhaps that could have happened in this case?

You want to see something sketchy look at primer swapping using a Fed 209A I think it was .
Milton C Starr is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-09-2022, 07:53 AM   #24
Member
J.B. Books
PGCA Member
 
Pete Lester's Avatar

Member Info
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 2,850
Thanks: 1,631
Thanked 4,762 Times in 1,358 Posts

Default

Here are the testing data sheets on the 20 gauge loads in question that had pressures roughly 3500 psi higher with Cheddite primers than the same loading using Win 209 primers. They also increased velocity by about 100 fps.

For reference Alliant data for Win209 primer is:

The first load with a Win 209 and 15.7 gr of 20/28 is listed on the Alliant Reloading Guide as being 1200 fps and 9370 psi.

The second load with a Win 209 and 16.7 gr of 20/28 is listed on the Alliant Reloading Guide as being 1250 fps and 10,490 psi.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Cheddite2.JPG (53.2 KB, 9 views)
File Type: jpg Cheddite.JPG (58.5 KB, 4 views)
__________________
Progress is the mortal enemy of the Outdoorsman.
Pete Lester is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-09-2022, 09:34 AM   #25
Member
Jim Thoma
PGCA Member

Member Info
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 285
Thanks: 13
Thanked 145 Times in 51 Posts

Default

Will dropping the powder help with pressure ?
Jim Thoma is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-09-2022, 10:40 AM   #26
Member
Mike of the Mountain
PGCA Lifetime
Member

Member Info
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 4,576
Thanks: 15,126
Thanked 8,320 Times in 2,544 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Thoma View Post
Will dropping the powder help with pressure ?
It absolutely should. One could use a different powder too. No need to shoot 1300 FPS loads. They won't make any bird more dead or make an XX on the scoresheet better than an 1160 FPS load will.
Mike Koneski is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Mike Koneski For Your Post:
Visit Mike Koneski's homepage!
Unread 04-09-2022, 11:36 AM   #27
Member
Billy Gross
PGCA Member

Member Info
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 281
Thanks: 4
Thanked 170 Times in 66 Posts

Default

Unless you test the undocumented load, you have no idea of what the pressures are. Pending the results from Precision Reloading, I will reduce my powder charge until I get acceptable pressures. I will take whatever velocity I get. Billy
Billy Gross is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-09-2022, 12:46 PM   #28
Member
Keith Doty
PGCA Member
 
Keith Doty's Avatar

Member Info
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 560
Thanks: 519
Thanked 697 Times in 284 Posts

Default

Identical loads, one in once fired Cheddite hulls primed with Fioche 616, one in new, primed Cheddite hulls. Unfortunately I cannot say which Cheddite primers were in the hulls as I bought them that way. Spit for difference.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 20 ga press comparison.jpg (177.7 KB, 13 views)
File Type: jpg Receipt_2022-04-09_103519.jpg (175.0 KB, 7 views)
Keith Doty is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-09-2022, 01:44 PM   #29
Member
Keith Doty
PGCA Member
 
Keith Doty's Avatar

Member Info
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 560
Thanks: 519
Thanked 697 Times in 284 Posts

Default

Got curious and dug out examples of a number of different gauge, new, primed, factory Cheddite hulls. 20 ga. paper and plastic, 16 ga. plastic, 12 ga. plastic, 12 ga. paper (no pic), 10 ga. plastic. I find a variety of sealer colors on the primers (no clue if that means something) and the 20 paper appears to have no sealer. All except the 20 paper have copper color primer bodies, the 20 paper is brass colored. Referring to Kevin's info, this would indicate all have the same primer but the paper 20.
In loading various "tries" that I had tested the 20 paper ran considerably higher pressure than identical loads in plastic with what I know to be Cheddite 2000 primers. Now, is this primer difference or case volume? As I haven't accurately measures case volume plastic vs. paper, can't say. That's on my "to do" list.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_2609.jpg (529.4 KB, 2 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_2610.jpg (514.4 KB, 1 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_2611.jpg (514.3 KB, 0 views)
Keith Doty is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-10-2022, 12:04 PM   #30
Member
Mark Garrett
PGCA Member

Member Info
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 375
Thanks: 2,477
Thanked 195 Times in 107 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron Beck View Post
Hearsay has this increase as nominal, though that likely varies with powder type and other variables. Is that generally what you have seen Mark or is it more in line with the increase in the thousands?
Different powder , different hulls , and different payloads , they all vary nothing really nominal or lineal . Faster powders tend to spike more so than slower powders .

As stated crimp depth can make a big difference also.
Mark Garrett is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:01 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 1998 - 2023, Parkerguns.org
Copyright 2004 Design par Megatekno
- 2008 style update 3.7 avec l'autorisation de son auteur par Stradfred.